usfs helicopter rates

So this all begs a question how do we bridge the gap here? Maybe in talking to a 3rd party lender the FS would learn more about these challenges that industry is facing due to the well intended, but poorly delivered solicitation requirements? NWCG Standards for Wildland Fire Resource Typing, PMS 200 Although I dont know if this counts as a legacy platform. The blackhawk will not replace the 212 because it cant, and a regular category S-70 would have to bid three or four times the price of a 212 to make financial sense even if you could get a 4 year EU contract. Office: (208) 387-5610 Mobile: (208) 867-5073, Tonya Campbell,Contracting Officer Add to this that they are wanting us to throw all of this money into our aircraft to get on the contract (which is now a 10 year contract!) Fire managers recognized the value of helicopters to rapidly transport personnel and cargo to a fire, especially in remote locations. Potentially an EU ship could sit all season and never turn a rotor and they would only collect the daily rate. One has to write to the audience who butters their bread!. So, because the Forest Service wants to push all but the top tier of their options out, they are essentially putting every government agencys resources at risk. These helicopters can support firefighters on the ground by delivering up to 300 gallons of water to thefirelinein a bucket or tank. Mission: Designed to carry out close-air support at low altitude and low speed. United States Department of Agriculture (USDA) Forest Service (FS) Thats discouraging as it suggests that the customer really isnt listening and just providing the perception of doing so.your point of just not choosing to submit if an operator doesnt like it is incredibly insensitive and uninformed. Here is what they wrote. National Interagency Fire Center Those who can manage might do fineor they might just get tossed out with the bathwater.. Some Type 1 helicopters can also transport up to 15 personnel to an incident. In reality the CWN is the same, many times EU ships roll into a day by day CWN extension of their EU contract after the mandatory availability period is over if there are still fires. Then why are one year contracts with optional years considered a sustainable way for helicopter companies to provide helicopters for fire fighting? There just isnt enough. Helicopters were first used on wildfires in 1947. 0000000016 00000 n The USFS, forestry branch of the Ministry of Agriculture, is in charge of the protection of the largest natural areas, it is also the body that is officially in charge of this function at the national level. The banker looks at your household income and job stability. Office: (208) 387-5279 Mobile: (208) 608-6763, But look on the bright side the SMEs will feel like they are back in the military! Typos, let us know, and please keep in mind the commenting ground rules before you post a comment. Do you know anything that can replace a CH-54/S-64 or an S-61? MOU - Interagency Fire Helicopter Standards Forest Service Agreement # 13IA-11130206-011 . As for air assets, Tankers dominate the sky. Ignoring the facts of what that aircraft can actually carry, not what the vendor claims. 0000073974 00000 n Doing business with the feds is not for the faint of heart. We operate Type III helicopters and are now faced with 40lbs+ of equipment (costing over $60k per aircraft) to meet minimum requirements - things that we really don't need like a Traffic Avoidance System (but the ADS-B they required last year isn't good enough) and a loudspeaker (because yelling at the fire helps? PDF Welcome to the Nation's Logistical Support Center | National Thanks for giving us a voice. In addition the Logistics Branch provides procurement support for eleven National Cachesfor wildland fire suppression and prevention, as well as other emergency incident response activities. One vendor said new requirements could reduce the number of helicopters on contract. - R1 Overdue/Missing Aircraft Protocol, DOI Yes (work and train as a unit 40 hours per week. A 407 isnt a twin, even tho a 407hp will outperform all the above as a type III. Most exclusive use helicopters have a daily rate and a flight rate, but no guaranteed hours. 310-1 Wildland Fire Qualification System Guide. It doesnt matter what we say if we dont pay the price , the US Forest service only go and hire the Canadians to do our job. Rotating blades are also present and again play a discrete but essential role where their natural qualities are exploited at best. These helicopters are the largest that are used for fighting wildfires and can carry between 700 and 3,000 gallons of water or fire retardant. PDF 2023 US FOREST SERVICE AIRTANKERS - SCHEDULE OF ITEMS (April 26, 2023) Contact Us: NWCG Comments & Questions | USA.GOV | Notices | Accessibility | Copyrights | Linking Policy | Records Management | FAQs. If as you suggest they can choose to not submit a proposal then two things are going to happen: 1) that aircraft will not be part of the AFF fleet next year and 2) you will have less a/c in the future b/c of it. Qualification Category. PDF Cal Fire Emergency Equipment Rental Agreement 3934 Agreement Period Other aircraft can be rigged with a Bambi Bucket but several operators have made the choice to heavily modify their helicopters with internal bunkers and complex release systems. Type 3 engines and tactical water tenders shall be equipped with a foam proportioner system. Avian Aviation Biologist. These are not the usual 4 years contracts that should be announced soon. USFS awards 90-day contracts for 22 additional helicopters To meet this commitment, we continue to monitor and update our content to make sure our documents meet these standards. The A-10 is built to be highly survivable and can takeoff and land in locations near the front lines. No wonder there is absolutely no concern about the financial impact of this proposal. Note:Tanker capacity standards may vary by agency. 0000000716 00000 n Aero Flite, Aero Air, and Neptune all swapped out some EU aircraft but each still has the same number of allocated slots. hbbd```b``Od?eKfWI0, &}@b iH(O/ / 0000000923 00000 n There are still going to be normal cwn helicopters. In other locations they would just shrug their shoulders and walk away. TheNWCG Standards for Wildland Fire Resource Typingestablishes minimum typing standards for aircraft, crews, and equipment for national mobilization to wildland fire incidents. Large Jet Transport I say all you vendors simply BOYCOTT the USFS. I find it interesting that the WFT crowd is pro a next gen, advanced air tanker fleet (including the funding required) but is up in arms about a next gen, advanced helicopter fleet. N/A = Not applicable These publications are "specified by more than 47 state departments of transportation," and is "the only privately researched and published equipment rate guide approved by the Federal Highway Administration for use on federally-funded construction projects." while simultaneously saying that they fully intend on moving to modern helicopters that are built after the year 2000 and are all twin engine. Same thing with Erickson. We speak of aircraft with a maximum mass of 3000 kg, and a payload of 1200 kg. The Forest Service also has helicopters on Call When Needed contracts, on the hope that they will be available when the phone rings. Entities without current agreements may contact the IBC-AQD Business Management Specialist at 208-433-5025. Rest assured the FS are aware of the concerns from industry, but everyone needs to realize that the FS is the customer. When the helicopter is in position, the crew releases the water to extinguish hot spots. Initial attack/can be broken up into squads, fireline construction, complex firing operations (backfire). Given the current climate of helicopter contracts there will be more people getting out of helicopters than getting into them. So this all begs a question maybe how do we bridge the gap here? NIFC Operations Support A Department of Defense liaison was added as a permanent partner at NIFC in 2008. Hawaii beats the national average by 4.2%, and Tennessee furthers that trend with another $4,165 (5.9%) above the $71,117. Look at the LATs this year. Aircraft types: P2V, HC-130H, BAe-146, MD-87, C-130Q, RJ85, C-130 H & J equipped with Modular Airborne Fire Fighting Systems (MAFFS). %PDF-1.6 % The EC135/145 have potential, but at what cost? i digress. Its coming, and sooner than you expect. Maybe in talking to a 3rd party lender the FS would learn more about these challenges that industry is facing due to the well intended, but poorly delivered solicitation requirements? NWCG operations standards are interagency by design; they are developed with the intent of universal adoption by the member agencies. Aerial SupervisionModule(Lead Planes) Office: (208) 387-5350Mobile: (208) 258-1450, Tessa Bach, Contract Coordinator The Q&A period is a nicety, but rarely ever provides valuable responses to industry. Topping the list is Tennessee, with New Jersey and Hawaii close behind in second and third. Type 3 Helicopters Although Type 3 helicopters are smaller, they have a higher cruise speed than a typical Type 2 helicopter and can arrive on the scene of an initial attack wildfire faster. On the other hand when your not spending your own money you can afford an almost $25 million firehawk. If any of those folks everrrrrr knew what it takes to run a rotary operation. Airtankers They ensure the impressive attack on flames with water. National Air Attack Exclusive Use Aircraft The companies willing to make adjustments will do just that and end up with contracts. @RtS1yD &LS,60E0U22U0J7gm:b|gY. Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) Coordinator So do we get balanced journalism here. What light twin replaces a 407? USFS FIRE CONTRACTS. Bill would rather not take his private industry advertisers $$$, but he should and needs to get paid for the hard work he puts in and he knows you Government boys cant/wont pay him to tell the truth. Lots more. They are versatile fire management tools. National Call-When-NeededHelicopters (Large Fire Support/Initial Attack)Flight Rate Charts Effective February 16, 2021for contracts awarded 2013-2017Flight Rate Charts Effective February 16, 2021 for contracts awarded 2018-2021Region 5 Aviation NRCC >>> Logistics / Dispatch >> Aviation The "All Other" annual billable rate will be used to obtain reimbursement for services provided to organizations outside the Federal government. Being able to pump water from bodies of water inaccessible to fixed wings, they operate with fast rotations and can also be loaded to delay if necessary, thanks to mobile cages that firefighters can position close to the area of operations. Application of gel, foam or retardant? I also think your comments are short sighted on Bills pandering to industry. AMS Mission Codes. Office: (208) 387-5695 Mobile: (208) 860-7334 ). & Booklets), FS The Branch is comprised of two teams; aviation and logistics. startxref They claim that 2 times throughout the 1/9 year parent contract, they will allow onboarding of new vendors/equipment. They are all tied to contractors in the business. United States Department of the Interior (DOI) Office of Aviation Services (OAS) and the . 34 Type 2 helicopters awarded contracts - Fire Aviation We operate Type III helicopters and are now faced with 40lbs+ of equipment (costing over $60k per aircraft) to meet minimum requirements things that we really dont need like a Traffic Avoidance System (but the ADS-B they required last year isnt good enough) and a loudspeaker (because yelling at the fire helps?). Candidates include the Bell 429, Airbus/Eurocopter H135 or H145 or other light twins on the market. Nevertheless, in recent years, with the current situation, CWN aircraft have often been used. When the SMEs include pilots who had a previous career in the military, also Aviation Maintenance Inspectors who previously worked as mechanics in industry and the military, I do not think the label of career beaurocrart quite fits. I can see daily availability rates sky rocketing, which it sounds like is expected. Cooperative Agreements - National Interagency Fire Center Normally both are higher with a CWN. Note:Certain aircraft are specialized and will not fit this classification. The NWCG Standards for Wildland Fire Resource Typing establishes minimum typing standards for aircraft, crews, and equipment for national mobilization to wildland fire incidents. Some helitack crews are trained to rappel from helicopters to fires in remote locations. 0000006627 00000 n Each bucket has a release valve on the bottom controlled by the helicopter crew. National Type 1 and 2 CWN Contract: Very well stated on what most of us are thinking and in the same boat. SD3-60 Sherpas;Avionics; Maintenance We really love being on Team USFS. Crews from the White River National Forest, Bureau of Land Management, and Aspen Fire executed a prescribed burn at Collins Creek on Sunday. Just need to add, Mama told me the customer is always right. trailer Always use the applicable contract, CO/COR for specific contract administration information. Us | Site If the income is lower and lower due to LPTA and the job security is year to year with no guarantee, most lenders will tell you to try another house to mortgage your house. 0000004574 00000 n In the parlance of the agency, the bulk of the USFS firefighters are "1039s," referring to the number of work hours they are capped at in a given season. What will replace a 407 for a Type III ship? The Forest Service was looking for 10 helicopters in each tier, if available, with Mandatory Availability Periods commencing on either June 1stor June 15th. Interagency Standards for Fire and Fire Aviation Operations Obviously another FS fella here. And the hits just keep on coming. The FS is certainly aware of Mr. Gabbert who has reached out to public affairs folks within the agency on numerous occasions. Firewatch Cobra (Bell 209-AH-1) Aerial Supervision Helicopter Airbus Helicopters breaks ground on first helicopter as Leonardo: Centaurium Aviation Ltd. takes delivery of it Health Crisis: the French Gendarmerie air support. FS. Airtankers, Helicopters, Long-term Retardant Contracts. The Incident Support Branch (ISB) at the National Interagency Fire Center (NIFC) is located in Boise, Idaho. They can typically carry 700 gallons of water or retardant via a bucket or a snorkel that fills an internal tank. Maybe the PM, HS and the CO should talk to some a/c financing companies to better understand the reality of upgrading or buying new equipment. Aircraft Engineering Services The agency has posted a second draft of a new Request for Proposals (RFP) and will hold a virtual meeting about the contracts on September 29. Apart from a few military helicopters mobilized occasionally and only as reinforcement, most of the air assets used to fight fires in the US are the work of countless more or less specialized aerial work companies, who each have very varied means. The West coast of America was once again hit by fires this year, the intensity and devastation of which have rarely been seen so far, even though the 2017 season had already been long and dramatic. USFS awards 90-day contracts for 22 additional helicopters Bill Gabbert May 13, 2020 Contracting, Helicopters contract The U.S. Forest Service has awarded 90-day contracts for an 22 additional helicopters that can lift at least 3,300 or 7,000 pounds. 30 0 obj <>stream Category 2 is that of aircraft with 6,000 to 12,500 pounds at take-off and having a water carrying capacity of more than 300 gallons. TFRs List/Map, Nat'l Aerial Supervision Module (ASM) Lead Planes The table below shows NWCG minimum performance requirements for structure and, wildland engine resource types. Calculator, GPS AMS - Aviation Management System (AMD-23E), AMD-23E Instructions for USFS National Type 1 & 2 Call When Needed (CWN) Contract Helicopters hired for DOI Incidents, BLM Annual Helitack Data Master (January 2017), BLM Exclusive Use Fire Helicopter Crew Training and Experience Requirements, 14 CFR Federal Aviation Regulations (FAR), National Transportation Safety Board Information, Toggle Dyslexia-friendly black-on-creme color scheme, Aerial wildland fire training taking place this week at Channel Islands Air National Guard Station, Military aircraft equipped with MAFFS mobilized to assist with wildfire suppression efforts, First Annual National Wildland Firefighter Day Announced, BLM and Maverik Partner to Reduce Human-Caused Wildfires, Aerial wildland fire training taking place in Boise april 25-29, Andrus Center for Public Policy and Partners Seek National Student Congress Address Wildland Fire Management, National Interagency Incident Communications Division, National Incident Management Organization. Todd thanks for chiming in. They requested to remain anonymous in order to avoid retribution from the agency. Have a fire aviation news tip? National Exclusive Use Helicopters (Large Fire Support/Initial Attack) November 25, 2017 Revision 2.8 . A quick peruse through that Q&A shows that dozens of operators really gasped when this RFP came out. The banker looks at your household income and job stability. ALSE Handbook/Guide Ver 2.8 November 25, 2017 2 . Your last sentence in the nail in the coffin.seeing as that this contract will be LPTA and a year to year option, how do you finance a new a/c that will surely be $2-$4M on the low end? Maybe the PM, HS and the CO should talk to some a/c financing companies/banks to better understand the reality of upgrading or buying new equipment? ) or https:// means youve safely connected to the .gov website. National Maintenance Agreement, Robert Hoffman,Contracting Officer Well said Maghreb.sadly, doing so would guarantee financial disaster/bankruptcy for the industry while also ensuring that the country and its citizens in fire prone states would be without helos for many more years than just one season.I do love the idea as it would send a message for suremaybe a few calls to the White House make sense here? For information about Lower 48 Aircraft Rental Agreements, please contact John Anderson 208-433-5018, For information about Air Tactical Contracts please contact Matthew Allen, Lead Contracting Officer at 703-972-5080, On-Call Fixed Wing Alaska please contact Heather Sizick, Lead Contracting Officer at 571-479-0323, For information about Alaska/Hawaii Contracts please contact Heather Sizick, Lead Contracting Officer at 571-479-0323, For information about WHB and ACETA Contracts please contact Jeanhei Christy, Contracting Officer at 208-433-5019, For information about SEAT Contracts please contact Angelina Clements, Lead Contracting Officer at 571-479-0325, For information about On Call Small Helicopter Contracts please contact Austin Carter, Lead Contracting Officer at 208-433-5032, For DOI project or non-fire needs requiring a medium/heavy helicopter, please contact Austin Carter, Lead Contracting Officer at 208-433-5032 for contract and cost data information along with instructions for placing an order, Heather Sizick, Lead Contracting Officer at 571-479-0323, Aviation Information Reporting Support (AIRS), Fire Suppression & Search & Rescue Task Order Numbers, On Call & ARA Fire Suppression Task Order Numbers, DOI OC Small Type III Helicopter - Both DOI and USFS Task orders when hired under DOI, Forest Service CWN Medium/Heavy Helicopters Fire Suppression Orders 11/1/2021 Through 10/31/2022, DOI OC Small Type III Helicopter - National Park Service Search and Rescue (SAR), On-call Alaska Fixed Wing Sample Contract, On-Call Alaska Helicopter Sample Contract, On-Call Hawaii Helicopter Sample Contract, USFS/DOI Medium/Large Helicopter Contract, AQD-10 Airplane Rental Agreement Price List, AQD-11 Helicopter Rental Agreement Price List, AQD-13A Questionnaire for Airplane Services Requirements, AQD-13H Questionnaire for Helicopter Services Requirements, AQD-16 Contract Award/Renewal Recommendation and Funding Availability Certification, For Alaska/Hawaii Emergency/Fire/SAR task order numbers, please contact Heather Sizick, Lead Contracting Office at 571-479-0323 or Rebecca Fentzke, Division Chief at 703-964-5320. Bill do you have access to USFS decision makers? It has been lightly edited. PDF 2016 Standard Cost Components