Sold to Kens06. This video shows how I went about balancing my LC Engineering flywheel (35 lb steel) and AISIN CTX-107 pressure plate. do you know how to set the ring end gap? The goal is to make a power application the most efficient, as its not always about where the car is driven. I would send ALL of it to a good machine shop & have it balanced together as a unit. Have you tried to spin it with the presure plate moved around one hole at a time untill you find the best spot first? Many applications have little-to-no drivability downsides when utilizing a light flywheel. What is Chromoly? I think that bolt in the back of the Flywheel may hit the block anyways. Check out LMR's flywheel guide for all of the answers! I've been very happy . Check out our YouTube channel for even more tech tips, installation videos, how-tos, and more. These types of vehicles require a bit more weight to maintain proper idle and to get the momentum to move off the line. I recently had a Mcleod Street Extreme clutch along with a Mcleod steel flywheel installed on my 2000 Mustang GT. Many SPEC aluminum flywheel options, as well as certain steel flywheels feature a replaceable friction surface. The manufacturers we involved in this article have dedicated an immenseamount of research and engineering to develop a high-performance, highly capable flywheel for virtually any application imaginable. <>>> I need to take in my pressure plate and flywheel. Passwords are case-sentive.If you continue to have problems click on the Help Icon for additional options. This is the heavy spot. Weve taken the guess-work out by inviting three industry leading clutch and flywheel manufacturers, Quarter Master, SPEC Clutch, and Fidanza Performance for a question-and-answer session to eliminate the guesswork. Not saying it would be a bad choice in the streetcar, but you will notice you take a little bit more clutch slip to get the car moving. Roush is a registered trademark of Roush Enterprises Inc. Eaton is a trademark of the Eaton Corporation. The flywheel also provides the ability to start the car, as it is geared on . Chromoly is an abbreviation for chromium-molybdenum steel" due to its property of incorporating alloy elements chromium and molybdenum. ENGINEERED FOR BOTH STREET AND RACE APPLICATIONS. I'm sure there are more, that's who our shop and myself have used. However, that same flywheel would warp or even flex under the load of a larger style diaphragm clutch. These different types of flywheels do not necessarily affect the clutch assembly or operation, as most are actually designed to work with specific style clutches to avoid any adverse affects. It is machined from the highest quality 6061-T6 or 2024 T3 aluminum, each flywheel is manufactured to deliver optimum tensile strength, great heat dissipation and major weight reduction. Jenkins/Fidanza:One of the biggest issues that an enthusiastmay overlook is ensuring the friction area is clean of debris and greases or oils before installing the flywheel. As you drive a manual transmission car, the clutch is constantly coming in contact with the flywheel when you release the clutch pedal. I'm Jay Mack with latemodelrestoration.com and I wanted to take a few minutes to talk to you about the differences between 1982 to '95 five liter Mustang flywheels. Copyright 2023 Endgame360 Inc. All Rights Reserved. I would balance them before I put them in so you don't have the same problem I'm having. Yea,..you have to have everything that rotates including the washers and bolts and..andand send it to the shop and watch them balance it with the crank and all the parts attached to the crank. "the disc can land anywhere" - I shoulda thought of that! 4 0 obj Register now for free! Reply. Check with the vehicle manufacturer for testing specifications. Had two crank grinders running all the time. This is also why companies manufacture heavier weighted flywheels. These engines needed more weight to balance them so Detroit put some of the extra needed weight . The question is, do enthusiasts have to balance the parts themselves? Our job is to analyze the original flywheel and engineer major improvements. They did a Kevlar clutch for my ole 911, machine flywheel & pp, rebuild disc w/Kevlar was close to $400 w/shipping. I'm sure you do as well. Jerry I am just trying to help..I also did some learning the hard way.. Posts: 7,924. I recently purchased a Hays clutch kit along with a new flywheel and in the "Dos & Dont's Problems" paperwork from Hays. Is this a good idea? Cause you know while you're balancing it, you could always take off a few lbs. lol, any race rules where you can "balance a flywheel" please they're shaving off every ounce of weight possible claiming it was necessary for balancing because no one is going to check the damn flywheel, After starting my tear down, i realized how bad my flywheel, PP, and clutch plate really is. While the flywheel is not an obscure component to comprehend, selecting the proper flywheel for a specific application is often shrouded in mystery for manyenthusiasts. Steel is the best friction surface for most materials because it offers a good seatability and wear pattern. Technically the 4.6 3V is internally balanced or a "zero" balanced motor. However, in the world of aftermarket flywheel options, this isnt always the case, as it varies from application to application. Another broken crank would suck!. Sounds like $75 for the job, such a deal. In the literal sense, a flywheel is a large metal disc that usually made out of cast iron, steel, or aluminum and its usually thick and heavy to prevent warpage during use. Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.Give a car more power and it goes faster on the straights,make a car lighter and it's faster everywhere. Any of your stroker motors or engines that have had custom balancing work done are typically going to take a twenty-eight-ounce imbalance, but it could use a zero neutral imbalance. An easy test is to have the flywheel checked to see if it's zeroed. Little known fact Vizard has driven my race cars and I have a collection of pre publication manuscirpts I have proof read for him. Although some parts can be reused when changing a clutch, its often advisable to replace everything with new parts and get the flywheel resurfaced. A flywheelimbalance can destroy engine bearings and other driveline components if the flywheel is not balanced, and also not in its allowable tolerance. These are a very specific flywheel application and are not meant to be used on the road or in track vehicles, as the additional weight is not necessarily wanted in higher revving applications. Within these materials, a flywheel can have a specific grade of metal, such as chromoly-steel, 1040-steel, 6061-aluminum, or even 2024-aluminum. A quick image of a SPEC clutch and flywheel combination being manufactured. With certain factory applications,the OEM flywheel can actually be reused by having it resurfaced, creating a new layer of friction material for the clutch assembly and ultimately avoiding the cost of a replacement. I hope when you get it all together and running it does not have any unusual vibrations as you will have wished you took the advice. CA, Cobra Make, Engine: 1989 KCC from South Africa Right Hand Drive. How to resurface your flywheel, pressure plate & clutch yourself for free! When a clutch assembly begins to wear outandneeds to be replaced, the friction surface of that flywheel in that clutch assembly is often resurfaced instead of being replaced. It's actually done with bob weights on the journals, with harmonic, flywheel, and clutch installed - and a fudge factor thrown in for the. In addition, engine balance there are three other important factors to consider. The flywheel can typically be resurfaced pretty easily and should be a relatively low-cost procedure. Free shipping on all orders $100+ Lower 48 states only. For not a lot of money the crank could/should be done also. His passion for anything that is fast, or has a V8, brought him to Power Automedia. As dear old dad said advice is worth what it costs you and this I give you free. Your E-Mail and/or password are incorrect. For starters, you have your stock style, cast iron replacement flywheels. it'll take it dog if you don't do thismake sure you have road side asst. If my crankshaft has only been reduced by .010 and .010 mains and rods is shouldnt change the factory balancing. 10046031 Flywheel Dowel (Big-Block) Highly recommended for all high-performance and competition Big-Block engines; 1453658 Bellhousing Dowel and Clutch Housing/Transmission . A service shop may later add weight by welding small weights to the edge of the cover. The inertia properties of the flywheel can accentuate clutch attributes. Out of the box, the LCE flywheel was out of balanced around 36 grams (approximately) as I remember. Billet aluminum is suited well for the road course where you can have instant acceleration out of the corners. (REGISTERED USERS DO NOT SEE THIS POST/AD! PLASTIGAUGE the crank bearings? Can't wait to get it installed now. MSC offers new as well as several other suppliers. set cam timing??? your best bet and the smartest thing for you to do is.. find the best machine shop around next take the block, crank, rod's, piston's. According to Autoguru.com, the flywheel has a few different purposes. These can be found in drag racing applications, and even for marine use. As such, the flywheel can obtain hot spots due to the excessive friction and heat over time, which in turn can cause vibration whenever its engaging and when the vehicle is under acceleration. Broken cranks, cracked bell housings, are all a result of out of balance. This left me with about 14 grams out of balance. Check out this cutaway of an Optimum-SR clutch from Quarter Master which features a billet aluminum lightweight flywheel. With so many different choices readily available, we wanted to know how the different materials can affect the overall integrity of the flywheel and its drivability characteristics. What is SFI? On a racecar, the flywheel is often times made as small and light as possible. Action Clutch Chromoly Lightweight Flywheels have three major benefits: low weight, low inertia and high thermal capacity. You will need to know what imbalance the motor is that you bought. With so many performance flywheel options on the market today, it can be difficult to understand all of the different items available. how to install and prime the oil pump??? Or it will at least be very costly. They make/rebuild clutches with Kevlar and ceramic, and can balance the flywheel and pressure plate (not disc/diaphram). Ultra lightweight flywheels which are designed specific for race applications such as SCCA or SOLO racing androad course tracks these tend to be too light for street use, and can cause adverse affects in regular stop and go driving or traffic like stalling or high revving starts. You can get your damper repaired at this place. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. cam and bearings, frt. The whole assembly is then spun up to measure vibration, and the clutch cover (pressure plate assembly) is then balanced. They are now taking the clutch back out to balance the flywheel and clutch together. I have nothing to gain from leading you astray. I have used a tire balance machine to balance my setup. Another broken crank would suck!! I trust my engine rebuilder implicitly. It is a small block LA Motor with a mild camshaft backed up by a 833 4 speed trans. At one time or another, most of us have had to replace our clutch assembly in our vehicles; and we all know what a giant pain that can be. Our Chromoly lightweight flywheels have gone through and passed engineering tests up to 15,000-18,000 RPM.All our Chromoly Flywheels are heat treated for extreme durability and saves you money by resurfacing multiple times. Our flywheels are engineered to improve throttle response, quicker shifting, and reduces clutch wear depending on your drivability. Ideas or links to other posts welcome. It needs to be spun up and dynamically balanced. All of our aluminum flywheels include a hardened steel friction surface that is designed to be replaced versus being resurfaced. Also of mention is that sometimes shops balance the flywheel . Static is a good place to start but spinning the assembly is better also if you have the clutch plate centered in the assembly. Were a forum community dedicated to the Chevy Z06 Corvette. Any time you're going to be using a clutch that has a puck typeface, semi-metallic, ceramic, doesn't matter. The LS6 engine is balanced externally with balancing pins in the. Its recommended to balance the entire assembly as a whole after verifying the tolerance level of the flywheel itself. eV/ .c}%&?i.csayH,/~D^U! }X2pF?Ui4+D9?zsz0k n'O|oF}O3I}oa-7|. But it still merits checking, and some people may be more particular (especially for a race engine). This s a big reason but not the only one why serious racers build niter ally balanced engines as then all that needs to be done to interchange parts like the flywheel or flexplate . I want to register an account for free right now! All of our flywheels are SFI Certified which meet the top performance standards in the automotive and motorsports industries. I would order a new front pulley and damper. ), http://www.clubcobra.com/photopost/dall_Small_.jpg, ERA #732 - Pics from the ERA Owners Gallery. Pull your crank and have it balanced then have them add parts and balance each as they go. The bike is back together and it is very smooth. This route gives you an almost infinite lifespan for the flywheel, allowing it to be rebuilt multiple times without changing the dimensional features required for correct clutch operation. The ability of the flywheel to control heat and maintain tolerance can also prolong clutch performance and wear under extreme conditions. If you have a zero balance motor it means that you need a flywheel balanced to zero. Feel free to call us 208-453-9800. I can't seem to find anywhere that sells both together so I'm gonna buy em from separate places and save some money. Design by: PelicanParts.com | Powered by vBulletin Version 3.8.7Copyright 2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions, Inc. endobj The best place to go for anything Mustang related! But you should take the pair to a good machine shop and have the dynamic balance checked and adjusted if necessary. Spec 3 and Fedenza, no balancing no problems. Was a 50 ounce imbalance flywheel and it's a very common upgrade to make those a 10 and 1/2 inch whenever you go to swap out the clutch. The factory might use round weights to be riveted onto the edge of the cover. Changing a clutch in a car is never an easy task. Norton/SPEC:Steel, aluminum,and titanium are most commonly used to manufacture a flywheel. If it's a puck-type clutch, you're going to want to use either a billet steel or billet aluminum flywheel because a cast iron flywheel will just chew itself up. Additionally, on the manufacturing side,we heat press, fasten and in certain applications even weld ring gears to our flywheels. Let us know how it goes. That must be a clutch only price. The original rubber is probably hard as a rock now. By the same method one could balance , theoretically one could balance the complete motor in place. We promise not to use your email address for anything but exclusive updates from the Power Automedia Network. We will safeguard your e-mail and only send content you request. Action Clutch lightweight aluminum flywheels are designed, engineered and manufactured in the USA. As received, a new flywheel from the factory should be balanced within some industry standard, like a few grams or a few ounce-inches. Norton/Spec:Chassis setup, power curve, gearing, and tires are variables to consider when choosing inertia properties. The friction surface material and inertia most directly affect how the clutch feels to the end user, and will ultimately dictate other factors, such as performance and wear life., Our flywheels are designed as a direct OEM replacement, which means they willmeetor exceed all factory tolerances. However, when you get into the options from all of your aftermarket companies, you'll either have billet steel, billet aluminum, or both in fifty-ounce imbalance, twenty-ounce, and even a complete zero neutral balance. I sometimes feel I'm wasting my time talking to you guys. Not a lot of $ so you may be good tehre. "DETROIT" FLYWHEEL BALANCE - Certain model engines now being produced have incorporated a counter weight in the flywheel to compensate for the lack of counter weight in the crankshaft. Steve (CTR). Car is an 1986 Cutlass with a 6.0L LS engine and the transmission is a T56. Someone who has been rebuilding engines for 30 years+ and is still in business should know what they are doing. You need to check with the shop that did your balance work or any of your machine work to find out what flywheel you need to order. The posts are mounted to the plate base which should be on rubber mounts to the feet. The SFI Foundation, Inc. (SFI) is a non-profit organization established to issue and administer standards for the quality assurance of specialty performance and racing equipment. It has a tolerance. To clear up the confusion, lets discuss the differences between the two. The larger balancing cones used on the static balancer came from No Mar as I remember (for their BMW motorcycle kit). Each flywheel option the company offers is manufactured for a specific vehicle application, and different driving habits. Rotational integrity is maximized, as well as the ability to provide a perfectly flat surface for the clutch disc to optimize wear and performance. FOLLOW: : For registered members this ad will NOT show, Location: Palma de Mallorca, Spain, As we mentioned earlier, the flywheel is a specific component which must also be matched with the correct clutch assembly for that application. If you would like your login information reset, click on the button below to request your login information to be reset. Mal stop me man, Hey I'm OK. Flywheel Tolerance What Is It? If you read the manual it also states that the flywheel and pulley aren't keyed so you have to scribe the items to the crank and measure the balance pins depth, look at . YES! Related problem. The whole assembly is then spun up to measure vibration, and the clutch cover (pressure plate assembly) is then balanced. Never built another without balance. All rights reserved. Your Login Failed. You also need to know for sure what imbalance the flywheel and harmonic balancer are that you have. If you put a 28 oz flywheel, one that has a 28 oz weight tacked on somewhere on the outer circumference of the flywheel , the motor will vibrate like mad, eventually breaking something. We reached out to Dan Jenkins of Fidanza Performance, David Norton of SPEC Clutch, and George Hovsepian of Quarter Master. This question is important because many enthusiasts have claimed that depending on the material that the flywheel is manufactured out of, it can inadvertently affect the vehicles drivability. Aluminum is too soft, and titanium is too hard for most friction materials. He indicated that 4 cylinder cranks usually are fine and don't need balancing. That doesn't mean the shop did like that, they could have made your 327 into an externally balanced engine, but I doubt they did that. However, if a flywheel is manufacturedfor an ultra-lightweight application, then we wouldnt recommend resurfacing it. Every company manufactures its flywheel for different applications, power outputs, and overall drivability. 94 04 mustang Whether youre searching for a flywheel application for drag racing, autocross, road racing, or a daily driver, well help make your choice easier by discussing different materials and manufacturing processes. Balancing a clutch assembly is crucial to its ability to properly function, and it all starts with a balanced flywheel. Flywheels can be manufactured from any of a variety of materials, including various grades of steel and billet aluminum. Why Is It Important? SPEC maintains a one-one-thousandth machine tolerance to assure a perfect rotational integrity, fast clutch seating, and maximized drivability. Discussing Weighted Versus Lightweight Flywheel Options. for a new computer driven machine. On top of that, considering how long it takes to change out a clutch and flywheel set, its probably a good idea to do everything the correct way the first time around. The flywheel is a component of a manual transmission that helps to transfer power from the engine to the transmission. Each manufacturer has its own unique process for creating flywheels. Its a good idea in a high performnce application to balance the rotating assembly with the damper and flywheel. As long as it can be mounted on his balancer. Also replaced axles (Leobro's) No problems of this type before engine drop. :0). .Bi@f|nsK_A2^xMxTL-''P EU4Y#~'iwfR?Ny?|yE]EJ^yZ?6O&_'@g Crank flange bolt pattern/sealing arrangement. Fifty tonne power station turbines are balanced this way. Steve (CTR). If reusing the old pulley check for seal wear and possible wear in the bore and keyway. Any imbalance will be felt , like a road wheel out of balance. From the factory, your '82 to '95 Mustangs came with a ten-inch clutch and was a fifty-ounce imbalance flywheel. Cobra Make, Engine: Everett-Morrison LS1. For example, a flywheel manufactured out of 2024-aluminum will work excellent when paired to a button-style race clutch. i know you don't with that done and you somehow manage to assemble the rest correctly..you will be able to beat the liven crap out of her for a long time. In drag racing, having too light of a flywheel will not slow the engine enough to allow for up-shifts. I'm sure it will be just fine it was before. However,a lightweight flywheel isnt always ideal depending on the application. Many enthusiasts can agree that a lightweight flywheel is ideal, simply because they have alower MOI. It will be set up in a spin balancing machine to be run up to a speed of several hundred RPM to measure vibration. Any guidance would be appreciated. Late Model Restoration has no affiliation with Ford Motor Company, Roush Enterprises, Eaton, or Saleen. The flywheel will be easy, the cast weight will be small for 28oz early style, and large for 50oz . //damperdoctor.com/index.php?route=common/home. fyi - for stock bellhousings, you have to match the flywheel size with the bellhousing & the flywheel determines your clutch choices. and this is just the tip of the iceberg. The clutch plate/disc does not get balanced with the assembly. Jenkins/Fidanza:Although a lightweight aluminum flywheel in certain instances is sufficient, enthusiasts may need a flywheel with more mass, or even one that has less mass than a standard aluminum lightweight flywheel. With that in mind we asked each for some strong tips, tricks, and general words of wisdom and information for enthusiasts regarding flywheel selection. Hovsepian/Quarter Master: Whether it's a lightweight or neutral weighted flywheel, it must be balanced no question about it. Most flywheels we produce are designed as a neutral, or as close-to-zero balance as possible, and are independently balanced to ensure they meet the criteria set for proper balance weight and are within the allowable tolerances. Rotating assembly will be shipped internally balanced. For starters, it provides the initial inertia to get the engine running and also provides the rotational inertia to keep it going, otherwise, the engine would stall when you lift your foot off the gas. Just my 02c. p.s. Last theory I heard on the FW and PP was that they could be balanced individually, but it was more important to make sure the flywheel jived with the crank. The World's largest I think that bolt in the back of the Flywheel may hit the block anyways. When spinning the slowly the posts will rock side to side. Do it right once or continue payingits an easy choice really!! Our flywheels are built for racing and performance. If that's the case, you can use a neutral balanced flywheel. Now that we know what a flywheel does, we can see just how important it is when it comes to the balance of the transmission, clutch, and even the engine assembly. There is a thread describing this on here. Were all for getting new parts, but does the flywheel really need to be resurfaced? Norton/SPEC:The flywheel is the component that contributes the mostto the performance and the overall drivability of the clutch system. If i hadn't begun working on my car, my clutch would of only lasted about a month, give or take. Check for imbalance by revving a known good engine to 2500-3000 rpm with the clutch pedal depressed and feeling for any flywheel vibration. All I have seen are junk. flywheel can obtain hot spots due to the excessive friction. Page 1 of 2 - Flywheel Clutch Balancing Information Help Please - posted in Injection Mini Specific - SPi/MPi: Again hello to all you good mini people and Spi lovers just nudging along with my build, getting to putting the box back on and then the flywheel and clutch As you can see from the pictures the original Spi flywheel is balanced with some serious little holes drilled out in strategic . Doing the rods, pistons and crank with all rotating parts other than disc current price is $250 to $280. It should also be checked There are a lot of different components to work with and remove before even getting to the clutch pack and when you finally do, you have to install the clutch and flywheel perfectly and then put everything back together so as to ensure you dont have to do the job again. The lighter and smaller it is and the closer the weight is to the rotational axis, the quicker the engine will be able to reach its maximum RPM. This is known as "Detroit Balance". % Action Clutch specifically designed our Chromoly flywheels for a reduction in weight and inertia for better engine response. My bits are ready for balancingthe second engine needs a SPI clutch (an MPI clutch was sent) and crank lapped then both can go off together. JavaScript is disabled. With so many choices on the market today, it can be difficult to choose the right one for a specific application. Spend another $20 and get the crank checked, piece of mind is worth it. In most cases, a ring gear can be replaced after starter damage or failure, without the end user having to purchase a completely new unit. We want to get to know you.Stay connected with us. The machine then shows where to remove weight and how much weight is to be removed, which is usually done by drilling holes in a non-contact area near the rim of the flywheel. Price of balance went up. If you're going to be visiting the track a bunch, doing a bunch of high RPM clutch dumps on sticky tires, probably not the best choice. This is the point we are trying to get across. Sabeo.m I just bought a nice used FW off fleeBay. I have been told that for an external balanced flywheel that there should be 3 large circular areas taken out further in towards the center away from the starter ring. David Norton, SPEC Clutch. <> About Press Copyright Contact us Creators Advertise Developers Terms Privacy Policy & Safety How YouTube works Test new features NFL Sunday Ticket Press Copyright . I am still welcome to drop by and use any machine in the shop. For example, a very light flywheel can make a clutch feel more aggressive. In the 25 years I worked at an auto machine shop I'd guess I worked on over 1000 balance jobs. Reducing weight (or MOI) will reduce the time it takes to reach maximum RPM, which is optimal for most road-racing and autocross applications. I guess that's why matinance records are so important when buying an older car especailly a 911. I now have a noticeable vibration above 3000 rpm. Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0. off centered off balance. A centre punch works pretty well to mark the parts. The balancing machine in the picture is supposed to have the piece being balanced spun , not too fast maybe 800 - 1000 rpm . An example of this would be a vehiclesdriveline set-up orthe type of clutch being used (pull versus push style). Balancing a flywheel is very important for rotational integrity and safety, and drivability. MSC offers new as well as several other suppliers. You may want to go ahead and step up to billet steel. Like many other go-fast parts, the flywheel is not a one-size fits all type of component. I have a vibration that starts a little over 2000 RPM and seems to fade way above 3000 RPM. We check for many things when engineering a flywheel, such as overall balance, flywheel clearances or how improve the design. with stanchion tube ultra low friction oil. Jenkins/Fidanza:It is highly recommended to balance the flywheel and clutch assembly together before installing them into the vehicle. to do the flywheel, back plate diaphram, pulley and damper using my balanced crank. They also do driveline repair. The flywheel is an important part of the clutch assembly.
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